Dsc Nightmare!!!

[Dave]

Hey everyone!

BMW Board newbie here....

Has anyone experienced this?:

I purchased my 02 330i about a year ago with 12k miles on it. From day one, I was getting an intermittent DSC (Dynamic Stabilty Control) light coming on, and the car would lose power. I took it to the dealer three times, and they could not figure it out. They said that it was not generating any error codes, and they could not get it to do it. Please keep in mind that I am not in a slide or breaking traction when this occurs. FINALLY I was able to get a technician in the car with me when it happened. Guess what they discovered? There were two different sizes of tires on the front! That should explain it they said... The car was sensing the differentt rotating speeds, and thought it was in some type of slide. Well, I got the original dealer to replace one of the tires with one that matched the other. IT IS STILL DOING IT!

There is no rhyme or reason as to when and where this happens, but it does it every day. It seems to happen most when I first start the car and take off. Again, I am driving "spiritedly" but certainly not close to spinning the tires... All I do now it turn the thing off as soon as I jump in the car.

Any clue? I would certainly appreciate any feedback. This is a great site by the way!

Thanks,

Dave

 

[Big Daddy]

My 97 Z3 did that when I pluse sized the front tires. However when I switched back to the correct size it quit. Can the DSC be re-set? I am just guessing because I do not know the answer.

 

[MyHarley]

[B It seems to happen most when I first start the car and take off. Again, I am driving "spiritedly" but certainly not close to spinning the tires... All I do now it turn the thing off as soon as I jump in the car.[/B]

Mine was having a problem at take off, when I would press the gas pedal, the DSC light would come on and then would not engage and then after about 5 seconds would engage and shoot across the road..........it has not occurred since I had the GPS2000 tracking system uninstalled.........somehow it was messing with other electonics of the car..........do you have any added electronic modifications??


My DSC still comes on quite frequently but it doesnt lose power..........the dealership says due to the road and my staggered tires, the car feels the slightest off balance........

The DSC never registered on the car's computer ................

My driver's seat belt does not always engage when the car is turned on.......sometimes it may be two hours before the seat belt engages....the light just stays on........I unbuckle and buckle to no avail.............the computer again has failed to register this problem..........

 

[Dave]

Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

somehow it was messing with other electonics of the car..........do you have any added electronic modifications??


Nope, no added electronics... I do have 255/35/18 on back and 245/40/18 on front?!?!?!

By the way, what kind of Harley do you have? I just got a Fatboy for Christmas.....

Dave

 

[MrElussive]

12,000 miles on three tires and 0 miles on the fourth tire may be the cause. I think that the tires should all just be gripping, but is it possible that the front "older" tire is getting less traction than the "new" tire and DSC senses that? Or maybe after all this time, DSC has become calibrated for that one odd-sized tire...has the dealership tried "resetting" DSC, if that's even possible?

 

[MyHarley]

Re: Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

By the way, what kind of Harley do you have? I just got a Fatboy for Christmas.....

Dave

My Harley is a 2003 Black 330CI Convertible.....its a tongue in cheek screen name......I love to ride and have many friends who have a Harley........my choice was to purchase a Harley and then find me a driver who would take me riding and keep up with the maintenance or purchase a convertible......the convertible was easier to purchase than finding a good man......... I know I know, slap me on that one.......

Congrats on the Fatboy!!! How nice!!!

As for your car, what brand of tires do you have........with the sport suspension of the car, staggered tires and bad roads, the slightest thing makes it helter skelter.........it takes three to four times to get the tires balanced and they have to twirl the tires on the rims to get it just right......

I dont think you ought to turn off the DSC tho........do you have to??

 

[Kirby]

12,000 miles on three tires and 0 miles on the fourth tire may be the cause. I think that the tires should all just be gripping, but is it possible that the front "older" tire is getting less traction than the "new" tire and DSC senses that? Or maybe after all this time, DSC has become calibrated for that one odd-sized tire...has the dealership tried "resetting" DSC, if that's even possible?

I think you have the right idea, but I'm surprised that it's actually THAT sensitively programmed. I assume that BMW's DSC uses the antilock brake (ALB) sensors and works like other ALB systems I have worked on.

The ALB wheel sensors (magnetic or optical) basically count multiple pulses per wheel revolution. The computer can then determine if a wheel is spinning differently. Going straight or a slight turn, the wheels spin at about the same speed and the computer does nothing. But if a single wheel spins or locks, the pulses from that wheel will be faster or slower. Then the computer applies the brakes, cuts throttle, etc.

So Mr. E's thought about the new (bigger) tire size WOULD send a slightly SLOWER pulse train to the computer. I'm just surprised that they didn't consider this possibilty when they wrote the software. Or perhaps they did, maybe it's just a bug!

 

[RoyE46]

You can get the new tire shaved so it has the same tread depth as the others. A friend of mine had to do this to her 4wd Subaru.

 

[bmwrocks]

Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

Mine was having a problem at take off, when I would press the gas pedal, the DSC light would come on and then would not engage and then after about 5 seconds would engage and shoot across the road..........it has not occurred since I had the GPS2000 tracking system uninstalled.........somehow it was messing with other electonics of the car..........do you have any added electronic modifications??


My DSC still comes on quite frequently but it doesnt lose power..........the dealership says due to the road and my staggered tires, the car feels the slightest off balance........

The DSC never registered on the car's computer ................

My driver's seat belt does not always engage when the car is turned on.......sometimes it may be two hours before the seat belt engages....the light just stays on........I unbuckle and buckle to no avail.............the computer again has failed to register this problem..........

You have some funky electronics in your car. When you say staggered tires I assume you mean different size fronts vs. rears. I think all the 3's have different size front vs. rears. Based on that ask the dealer why would your car be the only one doing this?

FYI I have 2 BMWs with DSC and I never have any "false engagements" with either one.

With my '04 330ci I accelerated to 80 around a 40 mph curve yesterday, just to see if DSC would engage and it BARELY did. I felt it slightly but it was almost not noticeable.

As far as the "road and staggered tires" explanation goes, they are full of it if you ask me.

And the seat belt light? Just shows even clearer that you have something going on in your electronics that is not normal.

Can't you hop in another car on their lot and prove your car is behaving oddly WRT DSC?

I wonder how may aspects of your warranty you voided by installing that aftermarket GPS that magically fixed things when you removed it........have they ever brought that up?

 

[MyHarley]

Re: Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

You have some funky electronics in your car


And the seat belt light? Just shows even clearer that you have something going on in your electronics that is not normal.

wonder how may aspects of your warranty you voided by installing that aftermarket GPS that magically fixed things when you removed it........have they ever brought that up?

I have a funky car period...............there is nothing voided with the warranty on the car because the man who installed the first tracking system paid the BMW dealership to remove the tracking system and work on the wiring harness to bring it all back to normal. He also paid the BMW dealership to install another brand tracking system that met BMW specs. So, its all documented with BMW and my paperwork fully states that there is no disqualification on the warranty and that all work performed is covered by the dealership.

My tires are 18" low profile and staggered which I do think makes a difference in the feel of the car. I have driven many 2003 and 2004 loaners, but none of them have 18" or have the sports package for me to compare, but the ride in the loaners is 100% different than the ride in my car, they are smooth, smooth, mine is feeling every little pebble.

The dealership says the seatbelt can be out of its boundaries depending on how the seat is positioned.........I know, yeah right.......the seat is memory and its not like I'm performing acrobatic positions during the drive........since they are currently replacing the seat railings and the headrests due to major rattling, they feel this may solve the rattling problem, as well as the seatbelt problem......my seats are definitely loose[fake] [fake]


BTW, welcome to the board.........!!!!

 

[William330]

Has anyone experienced this?:

...

Guess what they discovered? There were two different sizes of tires on the front! That should explain it they said... The car was sensing the differentt rotating speeds, and thought it was in some type of slide. Well, I got the original dealer to replace one of the tires with one that matched the other. IT IS STILL DOING IT!

It seems obvious what's wrong.

You say the problem was caused because you had two different sized tires on the front.

Then, you replaced one of the front tires with a new tire, leaving the worn tire on the car.

The worn tire will have a smaller diameter than the new tire. You now still have two different sized tires on your car, one 'larger' new tire (with all its tread), one 'smaller' tire (with its tread worn).

Replace both front tires at the same time, and I suspect your problem will be solved.

Good luck.

 

[Dave]

Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

It seems obvious what's wrong.

You say the problem was caused because you had two different sized tires on the front.

Then, you replaced one of the front tires with a new tire, leaving the worn tire on the car.

The worn tire will have a smaller diameter than the new tire. You now still have two different sized tires on your car, one 'larger' new tire (with all its tread), one 'smaller' tire (with its tread worn).

Replace both front tires at the same time, and I suspect your problem will be solved.

Good luck.

OK, good point......but do you really think that it would be THAT sensitive? It still had about half of the tread left. That seems like such an insignificant difference. Think I should have bought the similarly equipped/performing Taurus instead?

 

[bmwrocks]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

BTW, welcome to the board.........!!!!

Thanks, but you are 6 months too late......or are you just being sarcastic because I don't know your car's history?

 

[MyHarley]

you are so funny...........I was welcoming Dave to the board..........ummmmm he's a rookie and he started the thread............I know you well BMWRocks.........I'm still laughing..........I'm not that dense.........[:X]

 

[bmwrocks]

you are so funny...........I was welcoming Dave to the board..........ummmmm he's a rookie and he started the thread............I know you well BMWRocks.........I'm still laughing..........I'm not that dense.........[:X]

Oooooops....sorry MyHarley.

Welcome to the board Dave......

May all your DSCs be happy ones!!!!! I'm going to floor mine in a rain slicked cul-de-sac and turn the wheel fully to one side to see what happens........

 

[MrElussive]

Re: Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

OK, good point......but do you really think that it would be THAT sensitive? It still had about half of the tread left. That seems like such an insignificant difference. Think I should have bought the similarly equipped/performing Taurus instead?

Please don't ever say something like that again. Sure, that Taurus will probably run problem-free, but it won't last half as long as a BMW and it doesn't have half the technology of the BMW (which means less stuff to go wrong).
What really puzzles me is why received a brand-new car with two different front tire size. I mean, that is just unbelievably odd...you must be the only person in the world who got a brand-new car with two different front tire sizes.
I think you should try replacing the other front tire and see what happens. I agree with the others on this thread who said that the other front tire has 12,000 miles on it and that is quite a bit of tire wear compared to the brand-new 0-mileage tire now on the right front.

 

[Average Jae]

the fact that you have 245 18s on teh front on a 2k2 330i makes me think that the tires were upgraded at some point. what was the mismatch size that you were running on? also the fronts are rather wide, usually they are like 225s to 235s.. (not that it matters that much for the issue at hand)

also this maybe kinda dumb, but if what you have are aftermarket rims, try to find out what the offsets on those are. i was recently looking into getting rims for a winter tire set, and heard from a "tire expert" that bmws are esp sensitive to offset changes. it can only be like +- 5mm from the original factory specs. or they'll start to handle funny. i wonder if that would be enough to make your dsc think yer fllying off the road.

as for the tread life on one tire even if not for the dsc coming on, you should get them to be even just for the sake of handling. the car will steer to one side or another due to a psi or two difference between right and left. i'm sure the 12k warn tread verses brand new ones will make a big difference, esp if you got tread life of 280 or so, which will last like 30k, so a third if not more of the tread's already shot by my estimation.

 

[Dave]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

Please don't ever say something like that again. Sure, that Taurus will probably run problem-free, but it won't last half as long as a BMW and it doesn't have half the technology of the BMW (which means less stuff to go wrong).
What really puzzles me is why received a brand-new car with two different front tire size. I mean, that is just unbelievably odd...you must be the only person in the world who got a brand-new car with two different front tire sizes.
I think you should try replacing the other front tire and see what happens. I agree with the others on this thread who said that the other front tire has 12,000 miles on it and that is quite a bit of tire wear compared to the brand-new 0-mileage tire now on the right front.

LOL!!!
The "Taurus" comment was my feeble attempt a humor... This is my first BMW and it is a hell of a machine. I would really love to have the M3 however. Bigger, better, faster!

As for the mismatch on a brand new car, I bought it used from my local Ford dealer. Got a hell of a deal on it too.. They were pretty embarrased about the tire situation so they bought me a new one.

 

[Dave]

the fact that you have 245 18s on teh front on a 2k2 330i makes me think that the tires were upgraded at some point. what was the mismatch size that you were running on? also the fronts are rather wide, usually they are like 225s to 235s.. (not that it matters that much for the issue at hand)

also this maybe kinda dumb, but if what you have are aftermarket rims, try to find out what the offsets on those are. i was recently looking into getting rims for a winter tire set, and heard from a "tire expert" that bmws are esp sensitive to offset changes. it can only be like +- 5mm from the original factory specs. or they'll start to handle funny. i wonder if that would be enough to make your dsc think yer fllying off the road.

Thanks! I didn't know that about the offset. The owner before me put the 18" M rims on it, but I have no idea of the specs. I guess I could ask BMW.... I would hope that they would have taken that into consideration when diagnosing?!?! But as you know, I could hope in one hand.....

Thanks to everyone for the welcome! How many Texans to we have here? I know MyHarley is one....

 

[aNoodle]

Re: Re: Re: Dsc Nightmare!!!

You have some funky electronics in your car. When you say staggered tires I assume you mean different size fronts vs. rears. I think all the 3's have different size front vs. rears.

All you late model E46ers make me ill

My '99 E46 built the first month in '98 came with the same 16" all around, including spare.

Hell, I don't even have DSC...only ASC...but I'm not sweating that cuz my engine only cuts off in the most extreme of cases. BTW...I thought DSC would engage your brakes or vary the braking forces to correct an inbalance in the wheels in a turn...not simply cut power to the wheels which is ASC (or am I splitting hairs).