Winter Tires/Wheels Question

[raiyu]

I'm getting new wheels put on my car this week, the 17" M68 wheels . They are 17"x7.5" and 17x8.5", with michelin pilot sport tires, my question is how are they as far as winter driving is concerned. I'm up here in New York so it can snow heavily on occasion, or we can go through a light winter where its just cold with no real accumulation. I figure if we get any real accumulation I should probably have a set of 16"s on hand with all season or winter tires for better traction and because of the nasty salt and other crap on the road.

My other question is how are these rims/tires in the water. I heard that since they are wider the pressure they exert on the ground is obviously less so they hydroplane more, although my old 16" with all-seasons hydroplaned also. Im wondering if perhaps the tires themselves can help to give some added traction.

Anyway, any info is appreciated.

 

[donmbmw]

New York winter

There was a recent thread on this topic. Most folks on this site will tell you winter tires are the only way to go. I agree with that IF you are running summer tires. But I have spoken to several Long Islanders who went through last winters snow with all seasons and reported few, if any problems. So, imo its a tough call. Personally, I think I'll be getting Dunlop winter sports but I'll wait for a bad forecast before I do.

 

[raiyu]

The thing is the treads on the wheels now aren't all season, they are definitely summer. They are way too flat. But Im also just wondering about the general loss of traction in adverse conditions (rain, snow) because of the increased width of the tires.

 

[xmas63]

It makes sense that a narrower tire would provide better traction in the snow/slush, but it would be hard to quantify exactly how much traction you'd lose. One thing for sure though: there will be a *world* of difference between a summer and winter tire as far as snow handling. The last time I ran a summer/performance tire in the snow was, well, the last time I would ever do that. I'd have problems making it up even a small incline with just a little snow. The handling was so poor it was embarassing.

 

[raiyu]

Yeah that much I can tell just by looking at the tread, there are way too many flat surfaces, so I'm not really planning on driving it in the snow. Plus with the salt on the road I wouldnt want to damage the rims for no real good reason. I am a bit worried about handling in the rain. On my old 16"s I was always flying by people and had the same kind of handling and traction as if it was dry asphalt, I just hope that wont suffer too much.

 

[bahnstormer]

eh just keep your fingers crossed that we won't c much snow =]
snow tires suck in everything but snow, very little dry grip

 

[MrElussive]

raiyu, my car came with 18" Michelin Pilot Sports and I can tell you that they are a great road tire. The traction is really great and the sidewall is really stiff to take those turns real hard. As for rain performance, they are nothing amazing. I can spin the rear wheels easily in the rain, and as for overall traction in the wet, just take it nice and easy and it will be fine. We have had a crapload of rain in NJ/NYC this year and there has been nothing I couldn't handle.

 

[bmwrocks]

I can spin the rear wheels easily in the rain

I thought your car has traction and stability control? Or do you drive with them disabled sometimes?

 

[PuShAkOv]

I thought your car has traction and stability control? Or do you drive with them disabled sometimes?

Stability control makes sure one wheel doesn't get a head of the other... it does not, however, prevent burn-out.

No system can prevent spinnign since this solely depends on friction coefficient of the ground and in relation to the types of tires and thread.

 

[bmwrocks]

Stability control makes sure one wheel doesn't get a head of the other... it does not, however, prevent burn-out.

No system can prevent spinnign since this solely depends on friction coefficient of the ground and in relation to the types of tires and thread.

I am not sure what mods you have made to your car Push but my wheels are firmly placed and one wheel can never get ahead of the other, not sure what you are talking about here.

My understanding of traction control is that using the wheel sensors, the system can detect wheelspin. If it does, then using the brakes and engine speed and timing control, it can stop the wheel from spinning. Now before you jump all over the "stop the wheel from spinning" thing, let me clarify. It is an instantaneous stop, not continual, otherwise you would go nowhere. So the wheel will spin but not constantly, allowing you to maintain control.

I guarantee the system if working correctly will prevent dry pavement burn-out.

Did you know that in an all-out ABS stop, you will have wheel squealing as the system applies and releases the brakes a thousand times faster than you can? Just the wheels won't lock up.

 

[raiyu]

I havent ever been able to do a burn-out with DSC on, take it off, and thats a different story though

 

[PuShAkOv]

First of,.. welcome back Moisey .. workload must have died down RCN

By the statement "one wheel getting a head of the other" I meant one spinning faster due to traction, cornering or other factors. My back wheels almost always spin out on damp surface if I push the gas too hard; DSC on or not. I find that doing a burn-out not hard at all on my car.

 

[raiyu]

hey pavel, thats exactly what Im worried about. My new wheels are the same ones you have, not sure about the actual tires, I think the extra width might play a large role in decreasing the pressure and traction on wet surfaces, I guess I'll just have to get my car back and see if it handles any different (adversely) in rain.

 

[PuShAkOv]

I bought my blizzaks couple weeks back but I haven't put them on since the weather is holding up.

Not sure if M68 tires are winter or not.... but its suicide if you want to take them into NY snow with the traffic there. I barely survived with my sports the last month of last year's winter. The car was a hazard above the speed of 25MPH with only 1/2 inch of snow on the road. Couldn't get on my driveway which is almost perfectly flat.... and my end was almost going from side to side.... in other words: you have to be VERY careful to drive in them and on bad snow days you leave the car at home. I certainly not drive in snow in my snow summer tires again. Nonethless.. you can get used to driving the car in snow like this. Its not that horrible if you know exactly how your car is going to react.

I guess anything that has a conotation of "winter" tires would be great in winter even with 17" wheels. The great thread it has makes up for the size.

 

[donmbmw]

Now that I've got over 1000 miles on the 330i I have been pushing it alot harder. I can't say that I've had any "burnouts" but I've managed a couple of "chirps" from dead stop and one really nearly full throttle left turn onto blacktop from a dead stop. The tires squealed for a couple of seconds through the turn. The DSC was in full on position and the grip was fantastic. The acceleration through the turn and beyond was awesome. I was in the manual mode starting in position 1 and the tach showed a little above redline before I manually moved it into position 2. I'm running on Goodyear all season PS-A's. The car didn't fishtail, or wheelhop and I never felt that I was anywhere near loosing control. God I LOVE THIS CAR!!

 

[Average Jae]

just think of it this way, those nice mallable rubbers built to resist the heat in the summer heat and sprited driving will turn into a puck once the temp drops below 40s.. ie get hard as hell, offering not much traction, if any at all. you know how nice the puck skid along the ice? imagine your car on top of them.. fun stuff eh?

the winter tires are nice because they are built to be nice and soft in the cold. which makes them horrible summer tires since the tires all but melt in higher temps..
the tread designs also helps them maintain traction in the snow and slush.. make sure you get M&S rated, which means mud and snow.

 

[raiyu]

That sucks, I figured if it didnt snow I could at least run these tires with no probs, but if temperature is going to be a huge factor as well then it may get to the point that regardless of snow I will have to get a second set of wheels/tires on.

 

[green95ss]

I bought a set of Michelin Arctic Alpins mounted and balanced on a set of attractive aluminum wheels shipped to my door for about $700. That was the best move I made for this car--since I live on a big hill where even the snowplows get stuck in front of my house. My wife drives the 328i, and she has no problems in the snow. With the regular Sport package rims and ContiSport Contacts on, the car is all but useless in the snow. I could probably go further with my Grand National on its Drag Radials...

Hope this helps,

Guhan

 

[MrElussive]

I thought your car has traction and stability control? Or do you drive with them disabled sometimes?

I think when I had my accident, I messed up my traction control. Because sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. Sometimes I can just be accelerating in 1st or 2nd gear and then if I suddenly punch it (and the roads are wet...or even damp), my rear wheels will spin like crazy...sometimes traction control catches them, and sometimes it doesn't....maybe I have to test it out a little more, but I never turn my traction control off now and lately it's as if it's not even there. [???1]

 

[raiyu]

When did you manage to have an accident and what kind ?

I know pretty much anytime they have to do any work on your wheels the DSC, ABS, and the rest of the mechanics need to be reconnected properly so you may have something loose there if your traction control switches on/off.