Stop complainng about steptronic and...
- Thread starter E46_Driver
- Start date
Yes, I'm done visiting this thread.
I wasn't going to post here if it had stayed on it's original course of NHTSA activism. If they feel that's their best route, more power to them. But it seems that the only way some posters in this thread can make their case is by bashing and criticizing others, not by reinforcing their own cause and efforts. And that makes for a weak argument indeed.
I wasn't going to post here if it had stayed on it's original course of NHTSA activism. If they feel that's their best route, more power to them. But it seems that the only way some posters in this thread can make their case is by bashing and criticizing others, not by reinforcing their own cause and efforts. And that makes for a weak argument indeed.
You must be kidding me
How can anyone on thier third transmission that volunteers they have been "working with BMW" be taken seriously? What kind of "plan" is that?![[8]](/images/smilies/icon_smile_8ball.gif "Retarded [8]")
After much research the conclusion is that this is a widespread problem. If my car has the dreaded slipping trans I will printout your posts and ask BMWNA to explain why they were "working" and "planning" with you vs. informing me of the potential problem. This will be after filing my formal complaint with the National Transportation Highway Safety Administration. Have a nice day!![[wave]](/images/smilies/icon_smile_wave.gif "Wave [wave]")
How can anyone on thier third transmission that volunteers they have been "working with BMW" be taken seriously? What kind of "plan" is that?
After much research the conclusion is that this is a widespread problem. If my car has the dreaded slipping trans I will printout your posts and ask BMWNA to explain why they were "working" and "planning" with you vs. informing me of the potential problem. This will be after filing my formal complaint with the National Transportation Highway Safety Administration. Have a nice day!
Re: You must be kidding me
Just to make one clarification. I have said before ... and I'll repeat ... those who are still getting cars delivered with the problem tranny are well justified in feeling upset and in feeling that they should pursue some type of recourse. I still think the best way to deal with this is to take the information you find on this board to the dealer and let them know about it before you take delivery ... let them know that you want the thing fully researched and if necessary, test driven after being left out at night to ensure that you don't have a problem tranny. Looking at build date should begin to give you a clue.
After this, if you take delivery on a car with a problem tranny ... well ... then you can pursue it however you see fit. Want to go the legal route? Or with the NTHSA? Fine ... I think you are perfectly entitled to feel enraged and angered. And I can certainly empathize with you and don't blame you for doing anything within your power. Especially if you notified the dealer beforehand and they STILL delivered a defective vehicle.
BUT ... if you really want to drive a BMW ... and knowing what has been said here before about BMW conscientiously working on this problem and always standing behind their product and work ... is this the BEST and QUICKEST way to address this? I don't believe so. Think about how long and involved and costly a lawsuit will be. What do you think the NTHSA is going to do about this and how long do you think it is going to take? IMHO, it makes more sense to either not accept delivery (if you discover that there is a problem tranny), accept delivery while trying to push your Sales Manager for some monetary compensation, or to pursue repair/replacement. Seeing the latest feedback from everyone else, this probably won't take more than a couple of weeks and it would appear that the problem has now been resolved. In the end, that will be the quickest way to get you in a car that you love and that you want to be driving.
If you want to try to "teach BMW a lesson", I guess I can respect that ... be my guest. I've got too many other things to worry about that are more important. They fixed my car as soon as they had a complete handle on the situation, and that's what matters to me.
And by the way, I guess your definition of the ideal situation is for the CA or Sales Manager to come out to you as you are making the deal and say "sir ... you know ... there is a very prominent defective transmission problem with our cars, and just for full disclosure, I'm going to let you know that there's a chance you may get one". Do you really think it's realistic to expect ANYBODY who sells ANYTHING to do that? Most people would walk right out and buy an Audi. And do you think the NTHSA is going to be able to do anything to change this? By the time they get done with their investigation, the affected cars will all be out of distribution.
Look ... good luck to you guys ... I guess I can respect another approach if that's what you choose to do. But as Kirby says, please have equal respect for those who don't adopt your methods for what they feel are very good reasons and please don't bash them.
Enough said.
IMPORTERofRECORD said:
How can anyone on thier third transmission that volunteers they have been "working with BMW" be taken seriously? What kind of "plan" is that?
After much research the conclusion is that this is a widespread problem. If my car has the dreaded slipping trans I will printout your posts and ask BMWNA to explain why they were "working" and "planning" with you vs. informing me of the potential problem. This will be after filing my formal complaint with the National Transportation Highway Safety Administration. Have a nice day!
After much research the conclusion is that this is a widespread problem. If my car has the dreaded slipping trans I will printout your posts and ask BMWNA to explain why they were "working" and "planning" with you vs. informing me of the potential problem. This will be after filing my formal complaint with the National Transportation Highway Safety Administration. Have a nice day!
After this, if you take delivery on a car with a problem tranny ... well ... then you can pursue it however you see fit. Want to go the legal route? Or with the NTHSA? Fine ... I think you are perfectly entitled to feel enraged and angered. And I can certainly empathize with you and don't blame you for doing anything within your power. Especially if you notified the dealer beforehand and they STILL delivered a defective vehicle.
BUT ... if you really want to drive a BMW ... and knowing what has been said here before about BMW conscientiously working on this problem and always standing behind their product and work ... is this the BEST and QUICKEST way to address this? I don't believe so. Think about how long and involved and costly a lawsuit will be. What do you think the NTHSA is going to do about this and how long do you think it is going to take? IMHO, it makes more sense to either not accept delivery (if you discover that there is a problem tranny), accept delivery while trying to push your Sales Manager for some monetary compensation, or to pursue repair/replacement. Seeing the latest feedback from everyone else, this probably won't take more than a couple of weeks and it would appear that the problem has now been resolved. In the end, that will be the quickest way to get you in a car that you love and that you want to be driving.
If you want to try to "teach BMW a lesson", I guess I can respect that ... be my guest. I've got too many other things to worry about that are more important. They fixed my car as soon as they had a complete handle on the situation, and that's what matters to me.
And by the way, I guess your definition of the ideal situation is for the CA or Sales Manager to come out to you as you are making the deal and say "sir ... you know ... there is a very prominent defective transmission problem with our cars, and just for full disclosure, I'm going to let you know that there's a chance you may get one". Do you really think it's realistic to expect ANYBODY who sells ANYTHING to do that? Most people would walk right out and buy an Audi. And do you think the NTHSA is going to be able to do anything to change this? By the time they get done with their investigation, the affected cars will all be out of distribution.
Look ... good luck to you guys ... I guess I can respect another approach if that's what you choose to do. But as Kirby says, please have equal respect for those who don't adopt your methods for what they feel are very good reasons and please don't bash them.
Enough said.
Hi,
Clearly there are at least 2 distinct schools of thought at work here, and I guess that is the purpose of these boards. I am certainly a "newbie" who stumbled upon this trying to figure out what the h*** was wrong with my car. This and the other boards seemed to have been stuck in a "well you tell me what your dealer told you and we will compare stories" mode for awhile. It is clear to me now, that BMW (be it local dealers, BMWNA, whoever) were aware of this problem and continued to act in what can only be considered bad faith. Knowing this, I (personally) find it difficult to consider BMW as either the BEST or QUICKEST way to address anything. LarryE, you are correct, perhaps mine (and others) confidence is so shaken they should walk away from BMW. But it still sucks, and until these problems are resolved individually and yes perhaps even until I (we) see some real ACTION and perhaps God forbid CONTRITION, I am all for lighting as many fires as can be lit. That E46 found another way to stir the pot.
I think the more noise the better, not keeping this as appearing as a one off problem. It is not.
As for"And by the way, I guess your definition of the ideal situation is for the CA or Sales Manager to come out to you as you are making the deal and say "sir ... you know ... there is a very prominent defective transmission problem with our cars, and just for full disclosure, I'm going to let you know that there's a chance you may get one". Do you really think it's realistic to expect ANYBODY who sells ANYTHING to do that? "
Yeah, that is what I want. And if someone gets "caught not doing that..." I think it needs to be made a big deal of.
I also (as I have said previously) wish everyone the best of luck.
Clearly there are at least 2 distinct schools of thought at work here, and I guess that is the purpose of these boards. I am certainly a "newbie" who stumbled upon this trying to figure out what the h*** was wrong with my car. This and the other boards seemed to have been stuck in a "well you tell me what your dealer told you and we will compare stories" mode for awhile. It is clear to me now, that BMW (be it local dealers, BMWNA, whoever) were aware of this problem and continued to act in what can only be considered bad faith. Knowing this, I (personally) find it difficult to consider BMW as either the BEST or QUICKEST way to address anything. LarryE, you are correct, perhaps mine (and others) confidence is so shaken they should walk away from BMW. But it still sucks, and until these problems are resolved individually and yes perhaps even until I (we) see some real ACTION and perhaps God forbid CONTRITION, I am all for lighting as many fires as can be lit. That E46 found another way to stir the pot.
I think the more noise the better, not keeping this as appearing as a one off problem. It is not.
As for"And by the way, I guess your definition of the ideal situation is for the CA or Sales Manager to come out to you as you are making the deal and say "sir ... you know ... there is a very prominent defective transmission problem with our cars, and just for full disclosure, I'm going to let you know that there's a chance you may get one". Do you really think it's realistic to expect ANYBODY who sells ANYTHING to do that? "
Yeah, that is what I want. And if someone gets "caught not doing that..." I think it needs to be made a big deal of.
I also (as I have said previously) wish everyone the best of luck.
I agree with TIXX
I too want disclosure. A heavy dose of honesty and integrity would also help. Without this board I might have given up a long time ago. Some are willing to take a stand and not accept less than adequate performance. Now people are posting transmission problems during deceleration.... whats next?![[scratch]](/images/smilies/icon_smile_headscratch.gif "Head Scratch [scratch]")
Beginning to remind of AUDI's sudden acceleration problem.
I too want disclosure. A heavy dose of honesty and integrity would also help. Without this board I might have given up a long time ago. Some are willing to take a stand and not accept less than adequate performance. Now people are posting transmission problems during deceleration.... whats next?
Beginning to remind of AUDI's sudden acceleration problem.
The new transmission seems to have a power issue in 1st and 2nd. It seems more like a muffled "weak-slow-unfun-to-drive" car now. People often said the 325i was a slow underpowered car, it NEVER felt like that to me, now it does. It feels as if the engine can rev real high, but sound lower and not deliver as much power as it used to, it just feels that for the engine speed its not delivering enough power to the wheels....
![[confused]](/images/smilies/confused.png "Confused [confused]")
[???1]I live in Los Angeles and yes, I too have had the SLIPTRONIC problems. Last month, on my third visit, I finally got the clutch pack replacement repair done. I was told another car was having it done at the same time at my dealer here in Glendale, CA.
As a follow-up to Kirby and the other Slip'ers -- a question. This past week I had another strange thing happen: for 1 day, when I first started out from a dead-stop, up till I hit about 10-15 mph, I heard a thwacking noise like the drive shaft was hitting something (and it was more intense the faster I accelerated). The next day, as I was about to drive over to Pacific BMW, there was a sound like something snapped, then the noise disappeared. A few days later BMW said nothing was found underneath and no signs of scraping. That very afternoon, when accelerating from a dead stop, a similar noise happened, but this time only when engaging full or almost full throttle, just before you might expect a gear change.
I suspect maybe a faulty re-installation of the transmission after the clutch pack, but was wondering if anyone else has experienced this???
Thanks
Chris Welch
Clutch Pack is not the answer
You living in Los Angeles clearly disproves "cold start" slippage. The transmission slips period. It is simply exagerated during cold start. I was given this clutch pack many months ago. During deceleration the car would rev high and lurch forward. The car then would slip even at highway speed. Regardless, seems the people that filed complaints with NHTSA are making head way. Another board reports that the investigation has begun. Wonder what others will say when the truth comes out?
http://bimmer.roadfly.org/bmw/forums/e46/4731415-1.html
Good luck!
You living in Los Angeles clearly disproves "cold start" slippage. The transmission slips period. It is simply exagerated during cold start. I was given this clutch pack many months ago. During deceleration the car would rev high and lurch forward. The car then would slip even at highway speed. Regardless, seems the people that filed complaints with NHTSA are making head way. Another board reports that the investigation has begun. Wonder what others will say when the truth comes out?
http://bimmer.roadfly.org/bmw/forums/e46/4731415-1.html
Good luck!
Just say NO to clutch pack temporary fix
BMW TIS 24 07 03 Dated Feb 2004 clearly states the following:
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
BMW TIS 24 07 03 Dated Feb 2004 clearly states the following:
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
Last edited:
Re: Just say NO to clutch pack temporary fix
Car_54: I don't have the time to look through all of these appends right now, but if you look, you'll find examples of positive results. Don't know how to explain this TSB, other than to say tranny replacement may now be the preferred remedy and/or it is certainly less expensive for BMW. In fact, since it is dated Feb '04, this makes total sense because in general, people haven't been offered the clutch pack replacement as often lately. Also, see http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5815&highlight=tranny+poll.
And there's someone right here who's trying to tell you that he has had success with it.
Car_54: I don't have the time to look through all of these appends right now, but if you look, you'll find examples of positive results. Don't know how to explain this TSB, other than to say tranny replacement may now be the preferred remedy and/or it is certainly less expensive for BMW. In fact, since it is dated Feb '04, this makes total sense because in general, people haven't been offered the clutch pack replacement as often lately. Also, see http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5815&highlight=tranny+poll.
And there's someone right here who's trying to tell you that he has had success with it.
Car_54 said:
BMW TIS 24 07 03 Dated Feb 2004 clearly states the following:
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
Furthermore.....
This service bulletin is dated December 03. Updated to include the X5 on February 2004.
So to conclude folks:
1) This defect has been known and discussed by BMW for a very long time.
2) The service bulletin dd Dec 03 instructs the dealership to replace the transmission
3) These bulletins are in the public domain and can be found easily.
The people on here that have been "working with BMWNA" were either duped or are willing participants to this farce.
Lastly, please ignore me as stated previously.
![[driving]](/images/smilies/icon_smile_driving.gif "Driving [driving]")
Car_54 said:
BMW TIS 24 07 03 Dated Feb 2004 clearly states the following:
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
So to conclude folks:
1) This defect has been known and discussed by BMW for a very long time.
2) The service bulletin dd Dec 03 instructs the dealership to replace the transmission
3) These bulletins are in the public domain and can be found easily.
The people on here that have been "working with BMWNA" were either duped or are willing participants to this farce.
Lastly, please ignore me as stated previously.
Re: Furthermore.....
So ... my questions is .. how do you explain the people who have had success with the clutch pack replace?
Car_54 said:
This service bulletin is dated December 03. Updated to include the X5 on February 2004.
So to conclude folks:
1) This defect has been known and discussed by BMW for a very long time.
2) The service bulletin dd Dec 03 instructs the dealership to replace the transmission
3) These bulletins are in the public domain and can be found easily.
The people on here that have been "working with BMWNA" were either duped or are willing participants to this farce.
Lastly, please ignore me as stated previously.
So to conclude folks:
1) This defect has been known and discussed by BMW for a very long time.
2) The service bulletin dd Dec 03 instructs the dealership to replace the transmission
3) These bulletins are in the public domain and can be found easily.
The people on here that have been "working with BMWNA" were either duped or are willing participants to this farce.
Lastly, please ignore me as stated previously.
I was never looking for credibility. Look ... I have been trying to relate my experiences and to help people here. Why don't you constructively try to reconcile differences in data? Why don't you constructively try to get all the information that is available out there to help people? And lastly, why do you feel the need to make a fool of yourself and take digs at people without making any constructive contribution?
Look ... if you can make a good case for anything I have said here being false or inaccurate (and I mean a good case ... not just heresay), I'll happily stand corrected. But ... it seems to me that it isn't Larry who has lost all credibility. Oh ... that's right ... you never had any to begin with. Sorry.
Look ... if you can make a good case for anything I have said here being false or inaccurate (and I mean a good case ... not just heresay), I'll happily stand corrected. But ... it seems to me that it isn't Larry who has lost all credibility. Oh ... that's right ... you never had any to begin with. Sorry.
Re: Just say NO to clutch pack temporary fix
Car_54: So far the clutch pack fix is working. if car start slipping again or there seems to be some major problem in the coming weeks, like i said i'll be happy to let everyone know and i will def. request to get a transmission replacement or whatever else that works ... as of now, no probs and for now i'm happy
Car_54 said:
BMW TIS 24 07 03 Dated Feb 2004 clearly states the following:
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
Situation:
Customer may complain of a delayed P to D (2 to 30 seconds) during the first cold start in the morning.
Cause:
Unfavorable tolerances of C1 clutch housing causing internal transmission pressure leak after extended overnoght parking
Correction:
"On a customer complaint basis only after verifying the above situation, REPLACE the transmission with the improved unit"
BMW TIS is what is sent to the dealerships from BMW instructing them on how to proceed.
So who was saying the clutch pack was acceptable? Who said some were having "favorable results"?
Car_54: So far the clutch pack fix is working. if car start slipping again or there seems to be some major problem in the coming weeks, like i said i'll be happy to let everyone know and i will def. request to get a transmission replacement or whatever else that works ... as of now, no probs and for now i'm happy
Relax, it's all about the type of oil in the tranny. The clutchpack is most likely what is being done by BMW to their "RMFD trannys" and given to customers. Besides it is probably a better idea to get a clutch pack fix considering nothing goes wrong during the operation and they don't need to remove the engine. Getting a ne.w... sorry, remanufactured transmission one doesn't know where it came from or how many miles were on it, or what *NEW* problems you'll be treated to.